Is Modern Day Israel a Fraud?

[admin]

Hello all,

Short answer: yes I believe so. Let God show us through scripture.

Christians are Citizens of Israel

Ephesians 2:11-13

11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

So when we were without Christ we were aliens to the Commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the promise, etc. But because of Christ we are now no longer aliens of the Commonwealth of Israel.

Ephesians 2:19

19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

[admin]

So called Jews are not real Jews

Romans 2:28,29

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

So basically when you look at people today who are dressed up as Jews, or who identify as Jews, that does not mean they are Jews. God is saying that they are not Jews, those which are ones outwardly. Circumcision is also meaningless in this regard. God identifies Jews are believers in Jesus Christ.

Philippians 3:3

3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

God says believers are Jews ! Do the Jews living in Israel rejoice in Christ Jesus? No !

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[admin]

Jewish Synagogue = Synagogue of Satan

Revelation 2:9

9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

So when the Jews today say they are Jews....are they really Jews? God is saying, No they are not !

Revelation 2:10

10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

In the following verse God then talks about the coming persecution at the hand of the devil .... is there any doubt this is persecution from the Jews?

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[admin]

Revelation 3:9 on the Synagogue of Satan

Rev 3:9

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

God here specifically says those who practise Judaism (synagogue of satan) are lying when they say they are Jews. God also hammers the point by forcing the synagogue of satan to recognise that the Father loves the Christian believers.

[bibledude]

Do you believe that the church has replaced Israel?

[admin]

Yes I do believe this.

Israel (Jerusalem) is still very significant, because that location on the earth is the epicentre of so much that God has done through history and will do again in the future. For some unknown reason God has chosen this location on earth to setup his future millennial Kingdom, so because of all the prophecies surrounding this, God will be doing miraculous things in this region.

[bibledude]

Are you open to Replacement Theology being wrong if proven otherwise?

[admin]

I have looked into this topic a lot and I'm convinced modern day Israel is not the Israel of the Old Testament. Modern day Israel embraces homosexuality, Mardi Gras etc, is approx 98% Non-Christian (unbelieving) and owes its existence to the United Nations, which I consider like unto the Beast described in Revelation. IMHO today's Israel is a kind of counterfeit Israel, similar to how the Anti-Christ will be a counterfeit Messiah. We have the return of Jesus Christ coming soon, and just before that satan's counterfeit will come first to deceive the masses, the Anti-Christ, the false Messiah. I see modern Israel as the counterfeit "Millennial Israel", which will precede the genuine Millennial Israel to be led by Jesus Christ Himself for 1000 years.

But there are still believers in Israel today that are saved, a remnant. So some of modern Israel will be saved, yes, but God doesn't work under the Old Covenant anymore (with Israel), we are now under a New Covenant, thanks to the redemptive work of Jesus Christ on the cross.

I'm always open to scriptural proofs. Whatever scripture says, I will accept and acknowledge, as long as its in agreement with the KJV. I am a KJV only believer.

[bibledude]

You have a sober view of modern Israel and that is good thing. Most Christians today are very pro-Zionist without considering the Biblical implications of their belief. This is very important, not just from a contemporary perspective but also a Biblical one.

I think the Old Testament prophets have outlined in extreme detail the future of Israel. I do not think that the church has replaced them based on Romans 11 and many other verses in the prophets. The main issue is to see that Jews today have a day of trouble coming. They have broken God's covenant and as predicted are earning up for a final day of wrath. I love the Jewish people and pray for them from my heart hoping they receive the gospel of Jesus Christ. Unfortunately, the prophecies overwhelmingly reveal a terrible day of judgment for them still.

Luk 21:20-26 "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. (21) Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, (22) for these are days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. (23) Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. (24) They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among all nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. (25) "And there will be signs in sun and moon and stars, and on the earth distress of nations in perplexity because of the roaring of the sea and the waves, (26) people fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world. For the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

- Zec 14:1-2 Behold, the day of the LORD is coming, And your spoil will be divided in your midst. (2) For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem; The city shall be taken, The houses rifled, And the women ravished. Half of the city shall go into captivity, But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

- Dan 8:16-19 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of the Ulai, who called, and said, "Gabriel, make this man understand the vision." (17) So he came near where I stood, and when he came I was afraid and fell on my face; but he said to me, "Understand, son of man, that the vision refers to the time of the end." (18) Now, as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep with my face to the ground; but he touched me, and stood me upright. (19) And he said, "Look, I am making known to you what shall happen in the latter time of the indignation; for at the appointed time the end shall be.

- Dan 11:36 "Then the king shall do according to his own will: he shall exalt and magnify himself above every god, shall speak blasphemies against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the wrath has been accomplished; for what has been determined shall be done.

- 1Th 2:14-16 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans, (15) who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men, (16) forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

- Rev 17:16-17 And the ten horns which you saw on the beast, these will hate the harlot, make her desolate and naked, eat her flesh and burn her with fire. (17) For God has put it into their hearts to fulfill His purpose, to be of one mind, and to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled.

- Jer 9:25 "Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will punish all those who are circumcised merely in the flesh—

- Jer 12:7-8 "I have forsaken my house; I have abandoned my heritage; I have given the beloved of my soul into the hands of her enemies. (8) My heritage has become to me like a lion in the forest; she has lifted up her voice against me; therefore I hate her.

- Lam 4:6 The punishment of the iniquity of the daughter of my people Is greater than the punishment of the sin of Sodom, Which was overthrown in a moment, With no hand to help her!


Although God will judge them with destruction, He will redeem a remnant and restore Jerusalem again. However, we first must see that the Jews are under a covenant curse before we can see that they will receive a new covenant restoration.

- Deu 28:24 The LORD will make the rain of your land powder. From heaven dust shall come down on you until you are destroyed.

- Deu 28:48 therefore you shall serve your enemies, whom the LORD will send against you, in hunger, in thirst, in nakedness, and in need of everything; and He will put a yoke of iron on your neck until He has destroyed you.

- Deu 28:61 Every sickness also and every affliction that is not recorded in the book of this law, the LORD will bring upon you, until you are destroyed.

[admin]

Good post, I basically agree with you. I would just add that currently Israel is blinded in part until the times of the gentiles is fulfilled / complete. At the very end of this Age - at the 7th Trumpet (end of Daniels 70th week) the times of the Gentiles will end, the mystery of God being accomplished..

Revelation 10:7
But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

What is this mystery?

Romans 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.